Profile photo of mrfroggies By mrfroggies On April 18, 2013 Posted In X-Wing Miniatures Game

X-Wing Tournament II Round 1

Profile photo of mrfroggies
April 18, 2013
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I’m excited as the first round of play begins.  There are a lot of great players joining in this time with a lot of different lists.  I can’t wait to see some terrific matches take place.  As matches finalize, I will update this post with the scores and a link to the Log file so that players may review other players matches.  Now lets introduce the players and their squads.  Please let me know if I made any mistakes with the squad lists.  I received several last minute changes.  I think everything is correct, but if not let me know and I will update it right away.

The Empire: They are Fighting for you!

The Rebels: Remember Alderaan!

First Round Matches:

Will Balvanz L VS Ryan Voigt W Game Log
Ron Brannan L VS Chris Engler W Game Log
Trenden Flanigan W VS Jesus Sanchez L Game Log
Nikolaj Friis Hansen W VS Keith Wilson L Game Log
Patrick Corifxsen L VS Roy Engebakken MW Game Log
Russell W VS Aaron Bonar L Game Log
Richard White W VS Joshua Brown L Game Log
Jeff Wilder W VS Garrett Hughes L Game Log
Kevin Allen W VS Robert McCowen L Game Log
Zach Bunn L VS Michael Juneau W Game Log
Mike Rebman L VS Theorist W Game Log
Doug Kinney W VS Gabriel Hughes L Game Log
Nick Harrison L VS Tony Frederico W Game Log
Bryan L VS Trevor Payton W Game Log
Scott Williams W VS Commander Stew L Game Log
Ceodryn L VS Gabor Horn W Game Log

Vassal Etiquette:

I wanted to touch on this subject before the tournament gets going full steam.  I wanted to just put this out there for people, as a general guide.

  • If you are observing another players match, please refrain from commenting on the match, or giving advice.  If you want to talk to other spectators, there is a private chat feature available.
  • If there is a rule dispute try to work out the rule together.  If I’m online I will be happy to make a ruling.  You may also ask spectators what they think.  If neither player can come to a resolution, then you can do a couple of things.  You can stop the match, and send me your question, or you can continue playing and roll dice to see who wins the rule question.  Once you pick a way to handle this, then that’s how it will be handled for the rest of the match.  When you turn in your log file please let me know about the dispute, so I can post a ruling for the rest of the Tournament.
  • Try and be on time for you match, with your list ready to go.  A little bit of prep saves a lot of time for playing the game.
  • Please be considerate to players who are new to vassal.  Speed will come with practice and guidance.

Squad Deployment In Vassal:

  •  Each player sets up all his ships and movement pieces outside the map area, or in their hand.   Make sure your ships are numbered and labeled clearly.
  • Players determine initiative.  Initiative goes to the player with the lowest squad point total.  If both players have the same point total, then they will roll for it.  Each player will roll 3 attack dice, and the winner is the one with the most hits.  Treat focus as a blank, and critical hits are just regular hits.  The winner has initiative.
  • The player who won Initiative places the 6 Asteroid tokens outside of the Map area, and places the first asteroid.  Then each player takes turns placing the Asteroids starting with the player who won initiative.  Asteroid placement follows standard x-wing rules.
  • The player who lost choses player side, either Top or Bottom of the screen. UPDATE (see pg 20 rules)
  • Players place their ships in Ascending order of Pilot skill as per standard X-Wing Rules.

End of Match:

Each match will end in one of the following 4 ways.

  • All of one players ships are destroyed.  The player with at least one remaining ship earns a match win.
  • If at the end of 15 rounds of play, and both players have ships remaining in the play area, then games will go to sudden death.  One player will roll 3 attack dice, if you get 3 hits (that includes crits), then the game is over.  If you don’t then play continues.  Otherwise the player who has the highest squad point value receives a modified match win.
  • Conceding the match.  If one of the players can’t make it to the match, or during the course of the game find that they have no reasonable chance to win, they may concede the match.  The player who concedes gets a match loss and their opponent gets a Match win
  • No match takes place.  Both players get a match Loss.  If one of the players can’t make the match they should inform their opponent and me.  If you can’t make the match then it’s treated like you conceded the game for scoring purposes.

Scoring the Match:

Scoring the match will follow the FFG tournament rules.  Here is a link to the FFG Tournament Rules

Reporting Matches:

Please email me at ( mrfroggies@gmail.com ) with your log file.  In your email please post who won, how many points worth of ships you destroyed, and how many points worth of ships you lost.

Tournament Rules FAQ

I’ve had several people ask me questions on how I might rule on a given event, so I thought I would post a Tournament FAQ.  This is how I would rule a given situation.  Sense I’m playing in this event, I have Kevin Allan as my second for Rules clarifications.  If I’m unavailable then Kevin is your guy.  Some of these are explained via the rules, while a few on the list can be ruled on either way, and FFG hasn’t answered the question yet.  Here’s the list of questions and how I  would rule on them.  If there are others please let us know so that we can resolve your issue.

  • Vassal will often have ships with their sides parallel to each other, which will lead to minimal shooting distances that are not unique, but rather come in bunches. Some of these pass through an asteroid, some don’t, leaving us with the problem of deciding whether the defender gets +1 def or not?  If any part of the ship has a line of sight to the opposing ship then the defender does not gain the bonus defense.
  • Can you clarify when a unit is considered to have left the table and thus destroyed.  So, do you measure if the ship is out after the maneuver is complete, or as if the ship were following the maneuver template the entire way? The way we have seemed to play it is you test after the movement is complete, even if the template itself leaves the table. Only the final position matters.
  • Okay to measure Boost before committing? Yes.  Boost functions similarly to Barrel Roll in this manner.
  • Players assumed permitted to measure the current state of the table? (I.e., ranges, but not maneuvers?)  Is abuse of measuring recognizable as unsportsmanlike play?  You are not allowed to measure during the Planning Phase with maneuver templates or range rulers.  Measuring during the Activation or Combat phase is allowed.  I would consider it unsportsmanlike play to measure during the End Phase.
  • How does HLC work with TL? (In a game I was told that rerolled dice also have [crits] downgraded to [hits], but the HLC says “immediately after rolling your attack dice.” Does this trigger twice — initial roll, downgrade, TL roll, downgrade?)  This would also downgrade Target Lock or Krassis Trelix reroll ability.
  • Kath+Ion Cannon?  If the target evades then they receive a stress token, If they are hit and the Ion Cannon cancels out a crit, then they are just Ioned. They don’t get a stress token too. That’s how I want to play it until FFG puts a ruling out.
  • Daredevil and whether it adds stress/is changed by the R2 Astromech?  The R2 would override the red maneuver for Daredevil so it would be green.  You wouldn’t have to take a stress sense it’s now green.  You would have to check that the ship can perform a boost action, and if not they would have to roll for damage, as is explained on the card.
  • Gunner multiple targets we covered last tourney, but probably good to reiterate.  Yes you may choose a different target if you miss with your first shot.
  • Can you Boost and Daredevil in the same turn.  For example can Darth Vader with the Engine Upgrade and Daredevil elite pilot talent boost then do the Daredevil action? Yes as they are different actions.
  • Ion Cannon and Draw their Fire. Soontir took a Crit from an Ion attack and didn’t cancel it. The Black Squadron Pilot drew the crit, then it gets turned to a hit and the Black Sqaudron gets ionised. Would you agree? No and here’s why.  Both of these effects take place during step 7 of the combat phase. The order of when each effect goes of is determined by initiative, see Page 16: “If multiple abilities resolve at the same time, the player with initiative resolves his abilities first.”  Since both have the same trigger, it would come to initiative order.  But I don’t think it actually matters which goes first as far as the results. One important thing is that the Black Squadron Pilot cannot be the one to take the damage/ion token from the ion cannon.  The Ion Cannon only cares about who it hits, not who suffers the damage.  So even if the BSP takes the damage (which I don’t think it will, see below) Fel will still suffer the results of the ion hit.Just to make sure I’ve got all the players right: Ion Cannot hits Fel, Black Squadron Pilot with Draw Their Fire is close enough to pull the crit.Draw Their Fire first:
    1.  Attack hits with an uncanceled crit
    2.  Draw Their Fire resolves, pulls the crit over.
    3.  Ion Cannon resolves.  Fel suffers the damage and is ionized, because he was hit.  Ion cannon cancels all results.
    4.  With no results, there’s no crit for the Black Squadron Pilot to suffer.Ion Cannon first:
    1.  Attack hits with an uncanceled crit.
    2.  Ion Cannon resolves as normal.
    3.  Draw Their Fire resolves, but there is no crit remaining (the Ion Cannon canceled it).”
Links to the FFG Updated FAQ

General Questions:

After posting this, I received several very good questions about sort of general topics.  I thought I would answer them here, to help everyone out.

  • What’s a .vlog file? A .vlog file is a record of everything done during that session until the log is ended.  I use these to pre build my squads, and to record matches.  Here’s a link to my tutorial for creating a squad log file. In the Resources section I have files for all the ships.
  • When do we start the Log file? Please start your log file before you place your first asteroid.
  • How many rounds will the tournament be?  The tournament will go for 4 swiss style rounds, then I will cut to a top 8.
  • How would we go about making a page to show everyones play times?  You can post your schedule matches in the comments or you can make a blog post if you want.  To make a blog post you simply go to your dashboard then add new post.  I would recommend that players post their play times here, as many players will come here to look for information.

Resources:

Here’s some help links, and useful resources to have for playing.

This site has all of the Critical Hit text on one page, which makes things easier to look up while you play.

Here’s links to all of the Wave 1 and Wave 2 ships fully labeled for easy list building.

IMPERIALS

REBELS

  1. Ron Brannon: Please PM me with your availability. I live in the eastern time zone and my best nights to play are Monday, Tuesday, and Thursday. I could possibly due Wednesday but it would need to be relatively late in the day.

      1. Hi mate, well im gmt + 10 let me know what timezone you are in and what days you are available and want to play, I figure along as I’m not at work and its not like 3 in the morning on my end I should be good :)

  2. Definitely excited!

    One note, @mrfroggies: there are pilot abilities that require measuring with the range rule during the Planning Phase, including Lando and Squad Leader. Is it legal to measure, e.g., Range 1 from Lando after he executes a green maneuver?

    1. Lando’s ability, and Squad leader works during the Activation Phase, not the Planning Phase. Measuring during the Activation Phase is fine. I tend to be very easy going when It comes to measuring. If it gets excessive please let your opponent know, so that the two of you can come to some resolution. I don’t think this will be a big issue.

  3. Okay, now I’m a bit alarmed–the link for Kevin’s list leads to “Kath’s Counterstrike” (which may be a browser caching issue), and the only list that shows up when I search for “Prisoner Transport” is 150 points!

    1. The links are messed up, and I’m very frustrated with this. I spent a lot of time making everyone’s squad. If you mouse over the URL it should show a link to the correct name, yet for many the wrong list comes up. Some players have sent me links to their lists, and I’ve posted them. I’m working through the rest to try and fix.

      I apologize for the confusion, and I will try and get this fixed ASAP.

  4. I’m currently updating the post right now. I’m sorry about the links to your lists not working. It’s very frustrating to me. I made list for all the players, I’m not sure what happened so that so many are broken. Please be patient with me as I correct this.

    1. Here’s how I would rule on that.

      According to Ion Token Rule card, during the Planning Phase section: The owner does not assign a maneuver dial to this ship. If you can’t assign it then you can’t “reveal” it.

      1. To be fair, it’s a picky enough wording point that I’d have been willing to roll off on it or go the other way had that been the consensus.

  5. This is a seriously noobish question, but in Face to Face tournaments you are usually stood on a side of the table before you place asteroids and stick to it.

    How is set up meant to work? Is it place asteroids then pick a side? Who picks the side? Or is it take a side and then place Asteroids?

    The rules aren’t really clear and every tournament I have played in have you choosing sides before asteroid placement.

    1. It’s outlined in the post under “Squad Deployment”, although I understand how you missed it! It goes:

      1) Determine initiative.
      2) Loser picks a side.
      3) Winner places the first asteroid, and so on.

  6. How would we go about making a page to show everyones play times? I am not sure how to blog or anything. It may help out a little.

    I am in Eastern Standard Time and can play from Monday to Friday 10:30 am and have to be offline at 2:00pm for work. I can get on around 12:45 am until 2:30 Eastern time Monday to Friday
    after work.

    I can probally play almost any time on the weekends unless my wife has anything to say about it….

  7. Given that playing with all ships pointed down is a huge disadvantage (aggravating dyslexia when choosing on the dial), why don’t we play LEFT TO RIGHT? There is literally zero reason this could not be played left to right on VASSAL, and all players would need to do is tilt their head (left or right) to orient themselves with their own side of the board.

    I request that we play LEFT/RIGHT instead of TOP/BOTTOM.

    1. My dyslexia works best (or, rather, has the least impact) when I’m flying away from whatever side I’m on–which on Vassal means occupying the bottom of the board.

      But I think it’s completely reasonable for you to request of your partner that you play left/right instead of top/bottom, and if you are the player without initiative, you can pick whatever side you want!

  8. Question just came up in a game. Ion Cannon and Draw their Fire. Soontir took a Crit from an Ion attack and didn’t cancel it. The Black Squadron Pilot drew the crit, then it gets turned to a hit and the Black Sqaudron gets ionised. Would you agree?

      1. I would say that Draw their Fire Cant be used on the basis that the Ion cannon DO NOT cause any Crit damages even though it is able to cause a (ion)hit with a crit roll.

      2. Mrfroggies’ ruling is spot on.

        Niko: Draw Their Fire can definitely be used, because it triggers when an opponent hits a friendly ship, and the trigger (that is, the hit) happens before the dice results are canceled by the Ion Cannon. But of course, “cancel all results” includes the crit result that’s assigned to the ship with Deaw Their Fire… So you use it, and nothing happens. (c:

      3. and therefor it can’t be used……

        And by that I mean it is useless if you are meaning to use it to try to avoid getting the primary ship ionized :-)

  9. [In overly dramatic announcer voice]
    Tonight at 7:30 pacific standard time, witness the throw down as Jeff’s A Murder of Crows goes head-to-head with Garrett’s GLW Triple Shot! Be there to see some of the top pilots of the Rebel Alliance and Galactic Empire match wits in a heated battle of starfighter combat! Two squads will enter, one will remain. Check it out! Only on VASSAL!
    [End overly dramatic announcer voice]

    1. You need a sense of when’s the right time to place them, but it’s not too hard. I’ve used them in 3 games, and they’ve always hit at least one enemy. That’s great for not having to spend an action or attack, just 2 points. The best was when Wedge tried to overshoot it, but one of my TIEs blocked him back into the blast radius, which got him killed!

      1. Also worth noting is the deterrence factor of seismic charges. Many people will fly their squads differently than they had planned so as not to get hit by them. That will also increase their effectiveness, but it won’t show up in stats or game logs.

    2. Those little guys are fantastic. Last night I did 5 damage with 2 charges in one game, and 3 damage with 2 charges in the second game. In the second game there was only 2 ships on the board when I dropped the mines. They work very good against lower skilled pilots. Because you know where they are when you drop the mine. There is some risk against higher PS, because you are guessing, but if you know your going to hit 1 ship and you might hit one or 2 more then it’s worth the gamble.

  10. I’d like to thank Josh @stryker Brown for a great game last night that ended up being very close! Despite the 15hour time difference (played at midnight and 3pmish I think) I had a blast with him and @mrfroggies on skype.

    Josh stumbled upon an excellent combo in stealth, r2, and elusiveness on wedge. I think between those 3 upgrade cards (and 6 points) he managed to avoid at least 4 hits and changed one crit to a hit. That’s awesome value! Hell Wedge only has 5 total hp.

    Also Vader flew off the map…

  11. Hey Jeff and Garrett, I was reviewing your log file, and it stops in the middle of the second round. I heard you had Vassal trouble. Did you happen to start a new log file after the connection was reestablished? If anybody loses connection, this may be a good idea.

      1. Yep, what Garrett said. We thought it was my disconnect and our re-sync efforts that stopped the log, but that was pretty late in the game. No clue about early.

        I did send Scott a (very) general description of the flow of the game, such as it was.

  12. These are the general times I’m available to schedule games on VASSAL (Pacific time zone). These are start times, not end times.

    Monday through Thursday: 6:30 PM to 9 PM. (If a game goes later than 11 PM, I would need to save and continue at another time.)

    Friday: 6:30 PM to 11 PM.

    Saturday: 9 AM to 11 PM.

    Sunday: 9 AM to 11 AM.

    I have a working Skype account, and it does seem like voice communication makes VASSAL far faster to use. I’m also willing to give out my mobile number. Finally, I can be reliably reached via email at

    jeff dot wilder at gmail dot com

    1. um, I’ haven’t done the math, but I think there are 9 games left. Geez, if the TO doesn’t even know how many games are left…
      I move for a vote of no confidence, in mrfroggies leadership…:-P

      Can the Rebels even the score? I suppose they can. They have some good players yet to play their games. But the Imperials also have some really good players, too, and, well, Ricky, (:-P)so I think the Empire will continue to have the edge in round 1.

    1. It *was* a krazy kritzkrieg (like when Han rolled three crits and a hit), but I still say the game’s best move was you flying Dark Curse onto that asteroid to prevent an ionized Kath from parking atop the same. Since it cost him his life, I like to imagine the scene as Kath cursing her dead controls with the rock looming when suddenly a TIE suicide slams into it to move it out of the way. The end of the game would then have to be a paniced bounty hunter futilely fighting his console fire and careening to his death in the asteroid field.

      And my second Y-wing would be the pilot trying to coax his battered ship (held together by little bits of wire and good intentions) through a hard turn. “C’mon baby, hold together.”
      “I’m sorry Dave. I’m afraid I can’t do that.”
      *engine separates*

    1. Yes, he can. Being in contact with another ship doesn’t prevent you from performing free actions. As long as you don’t have stress (or, if you do, an ability that allows you to take actions when you have stress such as Tycho) you can perform free actions.

      1. I want to piggy back on this question. If he’s on the asteroid, but the maneuver templates for Boost and Barrel Roll also touch the asteroid, then he would not be able to perform his ability, correct?

      2. @parakitor: If he’s on an asteroid then we have lost is action AND his Attack (rule book page 20: A ship that is overlapping an obstacle token during
        the Combat phase cannot attack any ship but
        may be targeted by other ships as normal.)

        So no, since he can’t attack then he won’t be able to boost subsequently

    2. He still can.

      During a Boost or Barrel Roll a ship cannot end the move overlapping an obstacle, but there is no restriction or penalty for the template crossing it. This is the same regardless of when or how you gain the action.

      In your specific question though, remember that a ship that stops overlapping an obstacle doesn’t get to attack, so Turr wouldn’t have an attack to trigger his ability off.

      1. Niko’s response got me thinking I should clarify mine a bit:

        There’s nothing that would stop a ship from using Barrel Roll or Boost to get off an obstacle (even if the template hits the obstacle) IF they can get the action to do so. A ship loses its normal action for overlapping the obstacle, so it would need to be some ability to grant a free action. Turr can’t do this himself, since he won’t have an attack, but action-passing abilities like Squad Leader or Lando would work.

        It’s actually one of the things I like about running Squad Leader with Vader. Gives you a safety valve for getting your TIEs off obstacles if you screw up the movement.

      2. Doh! You’re totally right about Turr not getting to attack. Silly me. But I never caught the fact that boost and barrel roll don’t have restrictions on the template overlapping an obstacle. Interesting…

      3. The obstacle rules only apply when performing a maneuver. Boost and Barrel Roll are explicitly not a maneuver. Therefore, safe to cross.

  13. The person I am supposed to play still has not pmed me back.

    Is there any way that I can get rescheduled with someone that is active and having the same problem as me? I tried to pm him on Monday and on Wednesday with no reply yet.

    I am not sure of the etiquette on how this is done, but I would rather not have to take a by.

  14. Froggies;

    I have to put in my 2 cents worth on the
    “Kath+Ion Cannon? If the target evades then they receive a stress token, If they are hit and the Ion Cannon cancels out a crit, then they are just Ioned. They don’t get a stress token too. That’s how I want to play it until FFG puts a ruling out.”

    If I may go through the steps and refer to the rulebook along the way:

    Lets start by looking at the rulebook page 10:

    “1. Declare Target: The attacker chooses which
    enemy ship he wishes to attack.
    2. Roll Attack Dice: The attacker rolls a number
    of attack dice equal to his ship’s primary weapon
    value (red number), unless using a secondary
    weapon (see “Secondary Weapons” on page 19).
    3. Modify Attack Dice: Players can spend
    action tokens and resolve abilities that reroll or
    otherwise modify attack dice results.
    4. Roll Defense Dice: The defender rolls a
    number of defense dice equal to his ship’s agility
    value (green number).
    5. Modify Defense Dice: Players can spend
    action tokens and resolve abilities that reroll or
    otherwise modify defense dice results.
    6. Compare Results: Players compare the final
    attack and defense dice results to determine if
    the defender was hit and how much damage it
    suffers.
    7. Deal Damage: If the defender was hit, it loses
    shield tokens or receives Damage cards based on
    the damage it suffers.”

    And on page 12 step 6 is specified further as:

    “6. Compare Results
    During this step, players compare their dice results
    to determine whether the defender was hit.
    To determine whether the defender was hit, compare
    the number of {Evade}, {Hit} and {Crit} results in the common
    area. For each {Evade} result cancel (remove) one {Hit} or
    {Crit} result from the attack roll. All {Hit} results must be
    canceled before any {Crit} results may be canceled.
    If there is at least one uncanceled {Hit} or {Crit} result
    remaining, the defender is considered hit (see page
    13). If all {Hit} and {Crit} result are canceled, the attack
    misses and the defender does not suffer any damage.”

    Now let’s look at Kaths ability first:
    “When attacking, the defender gets one Stress Token if he cancels at least 1 {Crit} result”

    This pretty straight forwards points to step 6 regarding canceling of the {Hit}/{Crit} results

    Now for the Ion Cannon:

    “If this attack hits, the defenders suffers 1 damage and 1 ion token. Then cancel all dice results”

    The “…if this attack hits…” part points to the steps 6 and 7.

    OK, so let me run 2 simple scenarios: The numbering refers to the steps in the Combat Phase.I use Kath and Luke. Range (1-3) doesn’t really matter since there is no range modifiers for secondary Weapons.

    1: Kath fires Ion Cannon on Range 2 against Luke.
    2 Kath rolls 2 {Hits} and 1 {Crit} result.
    3: No Modifiers
    4: Luke rolls 2 {Evade}.
    5: No modifiers
    6: The 2 {Evade} cancels the 2 {Hit} results but 1 {Crit} remains uncancelled.
    7: Luke is hit. He is ionized but only suffers the 1 Hit Damage (or loses a shield). There is no Crit damage suffered.

    Scenario #2:
    1: Kath fires Ion Cannon on Range 2 against Luke.
    2 Kath rolls 1 {Hit} and 2 {Crit} result.
    3: No Modifiers
    4: Luke rolls 2 {Evade}.
    5: No modifiers
    6 (and this is where it becomes interesting): The 2 {Evade} cancels 1 {Hit} and 1 {Crit} result. THIS triggers Kath’s ability, and Luke thus receives 1 stress token. 1 {Crit} remains uncancelled.
    7: Luke is hit. He is ionized but only suffers the 1 Hit Damage (or loses a shield). There is no Crit damage suffered.

    So now Luke is Ionozed AND stressed.

    Even with a R2 Astromech he will drift 1 Straight Forward the next round and remain stressed.
    This is covered in the FAQ from february 2013:

    “Q: If two or more game effects conflict in changing the difficulty of a maneuver, which effect takes priority?
    A: An effect that increases the difficulty of a maneuver takes priority over an effect that decreases the difficulty. For example, if a ship equipped with R2 Astromech is dealt the Damaged Engine card, all of the ship’s turn maneuvers are treated as red maneuvers, including the 1- and 2-speed turn maneuvers.”

    Agree??

    1. I think this is actually what Froggies is saying, but he’s focusing specifically on what cancels the crit.

      – Defender cancels the crit = Stress
      – Crit canceled by the ion cannon itself = No stress, but the ion hit goes as normal.

      For the Ion move+R2 issue, the FAQ entry doesn’t apply because the ion move isn’t a changed difficulty. So nothing to stop the R2 unit from doing its thing.

    2. I also found the Kath + Ion decision to be reaching. The TO decides the ruling on unresolved questions, but that combo isn’t unresolved. I’m not saying it’s not a good question — but the Ion text clearly applies to STEP #7, not both STEP #6 and STEP #7. In STEP #7, it cancels the calculated damage results from STEP #6 and replaces the tally with 1 non-crit damage (and an ion token). It doesn’t cancel procedure in STEP #6.

      From the explanation of STEP #6:

      “If there is at least one uncanceled {Hit} or {Crit} result
      remaining, the defender is considered hit (see page
      13).”

      If you apply the Ion Cannon text retroactively to step 6, yes you get the same result as far as determining whether a ship was hit — but that is coincidence because of mechanics, not the order of steps as laid out in the rulebook. The IC text, in STEP #7, cancels the damage results calculated during STEP #6. It does not rewrite the procedure of STEP #6.

      Maybe there is a way to extrapolate the answer definitively in another way. Let’s talk about the defined interaction between Kath’s ability and Draw Their Fire. Let’s talk about the defined interaction between Ion weapons and Draw Their Fire. The answer to Kath + Ion will be in how those other interactions are handled.

      1. I am certainly not challenging the scenario that mrfroggies put up as an example. And I do agree with Kevin on the point he makes.

        Being Danish and not having English as my first language I simply cannot see where in my argument that I am trying to retroactively apply anything at all (from step 7 back to step 6); all I am/was trying to illustrate and/or discuss was that there ARE rolls where Kath WILL be able to ti cause both stress & ionization of the opponent

        PLease tell me if there is something I have written that is unclear in my example above, I really thought that by going through the combat Phase as per stated in the rules I wouldn’t go wrong.

        Still loving the discussions and the tourney in here :-)

      2. Your English was excellent, Nikolaj. I felt example #2 and the rulebook citations were, together, the point that needed to be made. It all seemed clear to me.

      3. TY for your feedback, Theorist. Being somewhat of an anal/neurotic nitpicking I sometimes simply HAVE to dissect the problem presented and have to go through the steps meticulously in order to fully grasp the concept.
        And the example presented by mrfroggies in regard to the ruling was just a bit too abbreviated to be concise/complete:

        And so to round this topic off from my side right now:
        My scenario #1 illustrate mrfroggies example and naturally no stress is induced.
        My example #2 simply illustrated that both effects can and should be applied in that instance.

        May the 4th be with us all
        :-)

  15. When I read Kath’s ability there’s something important to look at.

    When attacking, the defender receives 1 stress token if “HE” cancels at least 1 (crit) result.

    For me the key word is HE. If you hit the target with the Ion Cannon and do damage, It’s the Ion Cannon that Cancels the crits not the defender.

    1. I would concur to that part.

      If an Evade result or Evade token cancels a crit result, Kath could stress a target while firing the Ion Cannon. This is because Ion weapon text doesn’t prevent the check that triggers Kath’s ability; it cancels STEP #7 where damage is dealt and replaces it with the Ion weapon effects.

      If Kath rolls a crit result and the defender doesn’t cancel them, when the Ion Cannon cancels them it would have no effect. Kath’s ability only triggers when the defender cancels the crit.

      I’m surprised nobody has yet argued that female players are immune to Kath’s ability. They are not a “HE”.

      1. Although, now that I think about it, it does make sense to have Howl’s ability on a female pilot. All of the other gents are going to fight harder to protect her. Makes sense now…

    2. Hrm, looks like I misread what he was saying :) Oops.

      FWIW, I agree with Theorist and Niko (now that I understand how you’re phrasing this). Kath’s ability triggers in Step 6. The Ion Cannon’s ability triggers in Step 7.

      That said, we’ve got the ruling. I wouldn’t argue it mid-event like this at this point.

      Oh, and nobody’s running it for the tournament, so this probably isn’t the right place to be debating it :)

  16. Hey all,

    I need email address from the following players.

    Mike Rebman
    Doug Kinney
    Ryan Voigt
    Aaron Bonar
    Bryan
    Michael Juneau – Mu0n
    Patrick Corifxsen
    Jesus Sanchez – Ringo
    Keith Wilson
    Roy Engebakken
    Russell
    Joshua Brown
    CommanderStew
    Ceodryn
    Gabor Horn

    I need them so that I can use the TC tournament software. This will help me out a ton in managing the event, and also start to rank your games. Please PM me your email address. Thanks

    1. And done. Exciting game all around that ended with Krassis ramming Han so destroy the Falcon.

      Literally, actually – Han had a pair of Stunned Pilot crits, and Krassis positioned so Han had nowhere to go – hit him or hit an asteroid. Either way, one dead Falcon :)

      Thanks to Robert for a great game!

      1. He did indeed. I felt like we both flew pretty well. If there was a big decider it was probably that Howlrunner managed to absorb 3 shots from Han before going down. That gave everyone else time to finish off the Rookies, eventually leaving just Krassis and Han to duke it out.

  17. Just saw the last half of Patrick vs Roy, seems like Roy’s Han SOlo JUST managed to hang on while firing viciously back, and taking the final win in round 16. Patrick had a string of bad asteroid moves at Round 10’ish which turned out (as the do so often) to be quite deciding for the outcome. Good game, guys.

    Now it is soon time for Round 2, and remember; the Emperor will not be as forgiving as me!!!

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